What approaches to fixing noisy, unlevel, bouncy floors?

The fixes one was cautious about were; adding additional screws or nails, adding another laying of boarding on top of the existing floor, builders specification of cross bracing, and doing nothing (waiting for the house to improve). Adding screws to a JJI Floor Joist System (I-Beam, semi engineered composite floor) adds upto 12% improvement in performance, such as deflection. However gluing the boards correctly adds upto a 70% improvement - it is mandatory to glue the floor boarding to the joists, but that does not mean it was done, or that it was done correctly. If the above doesn't raise concern for a builder that wants to add screws to a defective floor, then the sheer numbers of failed attempts (such as adding screws) concluded the opinion I had to look for something better, with a realistic chance of success. The way one went, after an intrusional inspection to check joist design, span, hangers, etc and catalogue all the faults, was a combination of solid blocking and joist plating. Based on experience walking floors with various fixes, and on much research from various sources, typical cross bracing (herring bone strutting) was not the way to go.

Will It Ever Change For New Home Owners

Check out this forum post at Charles Church and Persimmon Homes Owners Forum. We continue to check new Charles Church and Persimmon Homes developments ourselves, and unfortunately quality issues that we faced have still not been addressed. One suggests you carefully check the standard of design, specification and construction - not just the things you can see, but the things you can't - and to ascertain the quality of flooring check for bounce in the show homes, and have someone listen underneath (downstairs) for crack sounds from the ceiling/joists/plasterboard when someone walks across a room above. I would suggest such faults are checked by a chartered surveyor prior to purchase, and a fix agreed and implemented up front. Better than having 3 months remedial work which if you live in will mean much dust and disruption, and if you move out (and later back in again) then the added inconvenience this causes.

They Did Warn Us They Would Pull Out

But is it right? Years later and we are still waiting for faults to be fixed.

Is it right that the builder can refuse to fix one item, because you have complained to the NHBC about another? Is it right that the builder can delay fixing an agreed item indefinitely, even when all parties have agreed to no delay?

The Persimmon Group plc, appears to be able to do what they want, when they want and the home owner is expected to just put up with it. That the NHBC would help them to this end is alarming to say the least.

Still we await simple and difficult faults to be rectified.

New Year, Same Problems, Can Charles Church Change in 2011

Poor Customer Service, Low Quality, and a lack of remedial work is still the theme for Charles Church in 2011. Just how long do we have to wait for simple plumbing issues to be fixed?

How many times can they (Charles Church, part of Persimmon Group plc, which also trades as Persimmon Homes) tell us they are going to fix them, only for them to do nothing?

The wait continues for a house we can live in or sell.

Persimmon Homes illegally demolished historic buildings in Banbury's conservation area to make way for apartments

In the news article, Devloper Lays Waste to Heritage, a housing developer has ignored planners and illegally demolished historic buildings in Banbury's conservation area to make way for apartments.

It was reported that Persimmon Homes has knocked down 17-19 North Bar despite warnings from officers at Cherwell District Council to stop work.

From my experience - with over 4 years experience of Persimmon Group plc, and their tactics, including so called 'indpendent reports' - I feel the judgment did not go far enough and that the fines need to be tougher.

Cowboy Builders, We've Had Enough of Charles Church

The lack of progress and constant battling gets harder and harder, but still we persist in complaining to Charles Church, Persimmon and the NHBC.

Maybe one day regulation and new laws will protect the home owner, and see that Charles Church builds home to a reasonable standard and that failures to do so are resolved in a reasonable time, with consideration for the home owner.

Westbury Homes, Persimmon Group plc, Feature on BBC Watchdog

Persimmon Group plc, again has one of it's company's featured on BBC Watchdog, regarding unsatisfactory quality and warranty complaints for Persimmon.

The original BBC Watchdog news article can be seen here.

Still Waiting on Charles Church (part of Persimmon Group plc)

Over four and a half years and still we wait for Charles Church to do the right thing.

The excuses and delays continue, with no resolution to our problems with the substandard new home they sold.

We continue to complain, and continue to wait for a satisfactory outcome.

Persimmon Group plc, Persimmon Homes, Charles Church, Westbury Partnerships

The advertising continues, painting a rosie picture of a safe investment in a new home from the Persimmon Group plc (which includes Charles Church and Persimmon Homes), yet the reality (in our 5th year) of waiting for snagging to be addressed is very different. In fact we feel our experience of buying a new home from the Persimmon Group plc is the total opposite of what we expected from the company's sales and marketing claims.

The customer complaints have continued for far to long with both Persimmon and Charles Church, with the standards being unsatisfactory.

Even the customer sales agents didn't give us an honest or accurate picture, with direct questions being answered incorrectly it later turned out. Yet at least one professional claimed the sales staff had been informed of issues with the new home prior to sale.

Does Anyone Care at Persimmon Homes or Charles Church

Customer Service is Dreadfull. I've never experienced anything this bad before. Years and Years go by, yet still simple faults are not being fixed.

Charles Church Reviews, Heald Point, Manchester

Heald Point, Cunningham Drive, Styal, Manchester, Greater Manchester, M22 5LT - a new Charles Church development, review coming shortly.

Thank-you to those that have contacted us offering to review new developments by Charles Church or Persimmon Homes, we look forward to sharing your opinions. More reviewers are wanted, please contact us.

Camber's Edge, Portsmouth, by Charles Church

Camber's Edge, Broad Street, Old Portsmouth, Portsmouth, Hampshire, PO1 2JE - another new development by Charles Church, but what's it really like?

Review coming soon from one of our followers . . . watch this space.

BBC Watchdog, Persimmon Homes and Charles Church

To quote BBC Watchdog editorial which also mentions Persimmon Homes and Charles Church customer service issues. "Two years ago, the NHBC received 63,000 complaints about faults in new houses but last year, during the recession, the number of complaints actually went up. This was despite 40 per cent fewer houses being built".

Persimmon Homes said "We take our customer service and build quality seriously. All new homes will experience a settling in period and it is not unusual for snagging to occur after completion. We endeavour to deal with all items brought to our attention as quickly and thoroughly as possible".

Perhaps they should be fair, and define 'as quickly as possible'. Does this mean 5, 6 or 7 years? And how can they possibly consider that as quick? Typical I would agree, yes - but quick, I think not. We've waited over 4 years now, and still Persimmon Group plc is dragging out remedial works and delaying, whether for the simplist leak or an expensive structural safety issue.

Show Home Review, Tanners Gate, Persimmon Homes

Interesting information on Persimmon Homes Tanners Gate development, in Hunts Pond Road, Titchfield Common, Fareham.

Dominic Harman, Persimmon Homes' Group Communications Director

This statement is taken from Persimmon Homes website. Dominic Harman, Persimmon Homes' Group Communications Director, statement:

"We welcome the new Consumer code for Housebuilders which we fully complied with in our original customer charter. The new Consumer Code has been developed over many months of consultation with industry stakeholders. It can only be seen as a positive step to further ensure homebuyers get the very best service that they should expect from a responsible and reliable house builder like Persimmon"

Kings Quarter, Bracknell, Charles Church New Homes

Kings Quarter, Siskin Gate, Jennett’s Park, Bracknell, Berkshire, RG12 8BF.

Review coming shortly.

Charles Church and Persimmon Homes, new developments and estate, get the inside track before you purchase.

Our reviews base quality on both the show home/s and the new estate as a whole, as well as factoring recent similar developments.

For customer service and warranty resolution issues, we weight the review more on new customers experiences over the last 2-5 years (or as long as issues take to resolve, 7 years is not uncommon with Persimmon Group plc). The new estate itself, with only a few homes sold/occupied will not be representative. In particular, it's easiest for Charles Churh to perform remedial work for a couple of house that have issues, whilst the contractors are still on site, plus if new buyers ask those first few customers about customer care and service they'll more likely give a good feedback in the first few months. Of course if you ask them 4 years later, when issues are still unresolved, then they might start to be just a little more critical.

Tell Us About Your New Estate Development

Have you been looking at buying from a new Persimmon Homes or Charles Church estate? Or have you bought recently? We would like to hear your views as a potential new home owner from the Persimmon Group plc.

In particular we are interested in the 'perception of quality' that Charles Church (the luxury new homes division of Persimmon Group plc) uses to sell new homes (witness the standards and quality of the show homes and marketing presentation, versus the quality and standards of the actual homes they build to sell to you (but not to use as show homes).

Thinking of Buying a Charles Church Home

I've had a lot of messages to me, from current and past customers of Charles Church. And most interestingly potential future buyers, whether of a brand new Charles Church home (enjoy the snagging, and get prepared for the long wait) or a second hand Charles Church home.

The second hand homes, may or may not have had any/all defects resolved. For serious issues, such as structural, it's wise to confer with your own surveyor, and the NHBC to check what would should be done if any.

Charles Church Floor and Plumbing Problems. Is It Only the First Owner that Need Worry?

After a long drawn out process, often taking 4 to 5 years, then maybe a floor fix, or plumbing fix might be implemented in ones property.

But the fixes the company uses can vary dramatically. Even though one house on an estate might be used as a test case, even if the approved fix is only just suitable for that house (and be aware that house may not be representative of the problem, it might be one of the better examples across a Charles Church estate), that house and others may enjoy a substantially better fix, than the approved (rolled out) method.

Why would Charles Church choose a 'representative home' as one with less of a problem? Because any 'approved fix' based on that home (even if unsuitable for the other homes) could save them money and still likely be rolled out for the other homes.

Noisy floors are one such example within a Charles Church home. When buying a Charles Church house design, which could be a larger or smaller design, either way, within the same house type, different fixes may have been done on different homes, some fixes better than others.

See comments below, for readers findings on Charles Church housing stock.

Charles Church & Persimmon Homes, Poor Customer Service, Low Quality

Charles Church continues not to fix the faults in our new home.